WCh 08 g6: Anand Won, Kramnik Done

Mig, contact Anand or his fan club and I am sure you will get enough compensation for your days loss or two!! Also a free day!!! Cheers!!

Yah, with the money they're raking in from this match they can afford to help out the little people! This trickle-down theory has never really worked...

If in tomorrow's match both get in time trouble in a complicated position, do you think Kramnik will offer a draw?

I think not. And the outcome will decide whether he bounces back or not. If Kramnik loses in mutual zeitnot tomorrow, I think the match will be over for him psychologically. But, if he draws or wins, he will bounce back with a vengeance.

Was there ever a world championship match where only black wins were registered?

Duncan

Mig, please consider censoring comments. We cannot afford another thread as ugly as the last one.

To be perfectly clear, I was referring to the game 5 discussion, not the miglet cute bomb. That we can afford more of.

Vishy has a lot more class than some of his fans on this blog for sure. A draw today will probably suit both players Anand to consolidate and KRamnik to get over the shock. If Vlad can draw today and his next black he still has a chance. Assuming he doesnt lose in the next two games then his next white will be his big chance to get back in the match. He should't fear repeating openings of game 3 and 5 if he believes in it. IT definitely leads to double edged positions with winning chances. I dont think they are the positions Vishy will now be seeking as Black. My bet is that Vishy would duck out next time.

Well, honnestly it's way less unethical to root for Kramnik today because of yours day's pay than it was unclassy yesterday to compare the respective merits of your daughter and a cell phone.

Back to game six now, two points down, four black games and three white games, match is over.

Who are Kramnik's seconds? Leko? Kramnik and Leko are both huge draw specialists. Do you think that they will help each other in a situation where you need to get from -2 with seven games left, and only three white games left?

What are the stakes that Kramnik plays KID and wins today? 1 to billion? I see...

I don't really think Kramnik need to (or if he does, has the time to) get over the shock with a draw.

Just keep on playing his own game, and if that is not good enough today, it will not be in two days either.

I'm quite enjoying the match, not sure who I'm rooting for, but a Kramnik win would do nicely right about now...

-Q

Match is far from over and I think 2 draws in the next 2 games will be good for Vlad. He then will need a big push with white over the closing stretch but if he wins game 8 match will become very exciting. To me this scenario is very plausible. Obviously Vishy is deservedly hot favourite at this stage but if he were to walk into Kramnik's prep then who knows ? It's been a terrific match so far and just a shame that it's only 12 games.

a) I certainly wouldn't argue against Kasparov. Obviously Kramnik has demonstrated that he can play for a win and get one in clutch situations, but it seems more logical to play comfortably and use the rest day to reorient the larger game plan.

b) It's never unethical to root for a match to hav a good, close finish. What you're saying it that you want it to go to tie-breaks. You're not saying you want the other side to win, right?

Kramnik opened with the Benoni in the penultimate game of the Brissago match. So a repeat of that?

Benoni against Anand? That would be a disaster. Better choose KID, it's more sound, and Anand has no experience in it, in contrast to Benoni, which he played against Karpov.

Ruslan: "Well, honnestly it's way less unethical to root for Kramnik today because of yours day's pay than it was unclassy yesterday to compare the respective merits of your daughter and a cell phone."

I agree fully, Ruslan !! I mean, compare the amazing path-breaking one-of-its-kind G1 Android to yet another cute human baby ? Unclassy !!

Yeah Benoni would be a poor choice because it loses it's surprise value having been tried already v Leko. Nimzo fine for the moment. Anand wont want a sharp battle with a 2 point lead. Far too early for Kramnik to try Benoni's, KID's etc. Trot out Nimzo and if Anand wants a sharp fight Vlad must have some prep and if Anand wants to gently press then a draw is acceptable. I think next big game is game 8 - i expect 2 solid uninspiring draws in the next 2 games. I expect KRamnik to go after the Meran in game 8 but I expect Vishy to duck out for reasons explained earlier in the thread. Great to have WC matches again.......

I agree with Mig that it's probably a tad too soon for Kramnik to trot out uncharacteristic openings. I don't think he'll steer it into a 12-move draw, but he'll play his usual style, looking for a small plus and hoping to grind it into a won endgame.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Anand play 1.e4, and then it's up to Kramnik whether he wants to play the Petroff as usual.

Benoni or KID its better not to be stupid.. Why would you choose a tactical opening against anand?? He can punish Kramnik for this.

Maybe Kramnik will play Grünfeld. He has lot of experience in it as white and played a game against Gustafsson in Dortmund.

I just want to see a more even game today ie one where kramnik does not get badly behind on the clock. In both Anands wins Kramnik has responded well and got reasonable positions but at a fatal cost in time. That is to take nothing away from Anand who has played a perfect match so far. One simple difference: innovations in Anands black defences can lead to winning possibilities innovations in Kramniks black openings tend to equalise. Which is another way of saying Anand plays sharper more aggressive chess.

He just played g4. Amazing.

I don't believe the Anand I am seeing. This fellow is out for blood in every game. I really thought he was going to take the safe route today, but Anand seems to be extremely disciplined about his game plan which is to get Kramnik into unbalanced variation-rich positions.

And he also had a novelty at move eight, which is unusual in top-level GM play.

Kramnik is down 2, but overall he shows a decent level of play. In both Meran games he played precisely for a while, being in unknown territory early and out of his comfort zone. The real cause of his downfall is that he tries to fight it out in positions that suit Anand's style. That's a losing strategy. Besides, whatever is Rybka's evaluation, it's harder to play white in these Meran positions.

Kaspy is absolutely correct. Kramnik is now paying the price for avoiding sharp positions for too long. Now he cannot them with a required precision. Sooner or later he blunders. If he wants to come back into the match, he must steer the games into positions that suit his style. At the same time, at -2 he cannot continue to play for a draw with black. He must go for a complicated positional fight, wait for a chance to get a slight advantage and apply pressure. Nimzo today was a good opening choice. Let's see if he gets a chance.

>And he also had a novelty at move eight, which is >unusual in top-level GM play.

Anand wants to be the first who throws the TN at any costs. In this case and position the "novelty" is sort of worthless.

>Kramnik is down 2, but overall he shows a decent >level of play.

decent on average, he plays very well 1st part of the game then he blunders in the 2nd ( health ?)

Anand isnt castling these days!

Anand is a pawn up, although black has some compensation due to the Rook stuck on g2 I guess.

Anyways it's almost a healthy pawn up. Wonder how much computers are giving- +0.6? +0.8? +1.0? Everything might just finish today.

Rybka is saying .85

Fritz 11 at chesscube.com has it as 0.85 now

I for one welcome our new Indian overlords!

(It's a joke - see the Simpsons)

Anand should win this he is a solid pawn up for NOTHING. If he does this could turn into a massacre. I think his opening strategy has completely confused Kramnik. Nobody predicted such a complete crushing Anand performance and collapse by Kramnik. He must have devoted 90% of his black preperation to 1 e4. Anand seems to have prepared only to play 1 d4 - brilliant!

I don't think computer evals are very useful when they are less than 1.0 or even just above 1.0. But, to his credit, Anand has been making moves that Rybka thinks are strong. If Kramnik continues to play solidly, he will be able to save this game and get a huge psychological boost. But given his performance so far in this match after approximately move 25, that's a big if.

29.Ke1 looks a bit stupid to me. Couldn't he just have played e3 and Rc2?

In retrospect he should have played the Benoni :)
It is shocking that Kramnik is getting into trouble in his own backyard (slow positional grinds).

Just came home from work, and it looks like Kramnik has lost a pawn a f t e r simplifying to his beloved queenless middlegame. I hope he can hold this somehow, and come back stronger after the rest day.

When you sacrifice a pawn and don't get much in return you have basically lost it ;)

IM Malcolm Pain:

"Kramnik and his team must be scratching their heads. He is being outplayed in complicated positions which typically favor Anand and he is also being outplayed by Anand in a dull and quiet position which supposed to favor Kramnik."

Sorry that is a comment by Susan Polgar

According to Rybka at ChessOK, there's no chance.

At Chesscube after 39 f6 says:

Fritz 11: White is winning (3.50)

I think, another player ( Carlsen / moro/ levon )should be given chance for next half.

That's not him.
Instead of playing the slow, quiet position slowly and patiently, he went for dubious activity.
Does anyone know if he has fallen in love or something?

lol

Oooh, this is too painful to watch. What a massacre. More than games 3 & 5, this one will hurt the most psychologically. Anand retains his crown. Only a miracle can save Kramnik now.

Maybe he miscalculated again and thought that he had a shot with 26... Nc5 ? I mean, he must have missed something, because the position after 26...f5 cannot be what he was looking for.

Anand has raised his skill level a notch, it seems! He's blowing out the statistical ratings expectations. Kramnik can't hold him.

from Susan Polgar site:
Kramnik and his team must be scratching their heads. He is being outplayed in complicated positions which typically favor Anand and he is also being outplayed by Anand in a dull and quiet position which supposed to favor Kramnik. They have to figure things out quickly as we are at the half way point of this very short match.

I think the match is over. Kudos to Kramnik for putting a fight yesterday by choosing a principal variation.

Actually I am sad about what happened today. Had Kramnik drawn today and won tomorrow, the last few games would be much, much more interesting.

Pity that it's such a short match. Now it's over for all intents and purposes. In a 24 game match there would be still plenty to play for. Kudos to Anand. He's indeed outplayed Kramnik in every aspect so far.

"Does anyone know if he has fallen in love or something?"

Well, hopefully. He IS married, fairly recently!

why is anand thinking so much to close this out!

Is Kramnik a masochist? Or is he in denial? Why is he still playing? He's making a fool of himself.

1-0

Well Mig, see what your poll has done to poor Kramnik. He clearly read it and got overconfident. I Hope you're happy with yourself.

Ouch. That was painful for this Kramnik fan. Kudos to Anand.

You may lose TWO days' pay.

Well so much for that. And the torture doesen't end - another black tomorrow. I stand by what I said earlier that Kramnik should have started fighting. At least going down in a blaze of glory rather than this embarrassing way.

maybe Anand didn't bother reading the rules carefully and probably thinks first to 6 wins get the title?! ;)

When was the last time a WC match was a blowout this early?

oh boy, this was massacre, it is just cruel and unfair to ask Kramnik to play chess at all, let alone Anand

IT IS OVER!!!

"Does anyone know if he has fallen in love or something?"

sheez, even i can come up with better execuses!

I wrote along the following lines yesterday: It is in principle possible for Kramnik to claw back from -2, but Anand has shown a superlative confidence from the word go, which I feel can come only from having prepared NUMEROUS novelties in more than one opening line, or even opening. So my expectation is that if Kramnik switches to other openings/lines the score could go -3 or -4 quickly.

Fairly prescient, it has turned out.

This is a comprehensive wipe-out by Anand, of Kramnik on all chess fronts - opening preparation, sharp style, tactics, slow positional grinds... hmmmm superb achievement since Kramnik according to many here is arguably the greatest match player ever.

Brillaint, Anand! WELL DONE

Kasparov-Short in 1993 was a pretty bad example. Short losing 3 of his first 5 I think. Though he missed several wins/promising positions in severe zeitnot.

Two pays day lost now, Mig.

@Kramnik
We want our money back.

The thing about this game is, I can't tell if Kramnik was trying to follow Kasparov's advice or not. He didn't go out and play anything reckless, but he just got ground down gradually.

Full credit to Anand for keeping the pressure on. At Brissago, after Leko went up by 1 game, he thought he could draw his way to the finish line.

"It ain't over 'til it's over."

It's over Yogi. [4.5 - 1.5]

Plus, there is every reason to believe Anand will continue to outplay Kramnik.

They need to get on with Kamsky-Topalov.

Anand-Topalov could be a great WCChamp match in 2009.

So why not play something full-blooded and die on the sword rather than this slow torture? Kramnik's c5 was a way of trying to resolve this mental battle within himself - the aggressive requirements of the situation and his normal personality.

How many more games is Anand going to win?? - this could start to get really embarassing. Maybe Kramnik should switch to 1 e4 and try to get a draw! i really think at this point Kramnik would be happy to get 6 draws and go away and lick his wounds. It was not necessary to play 18..c5?

Now it is all over for Kramnik...i mean who can come back from this? The confidence must be in tatters...Anand can now coast just like in Argentina. congs are in order.

Bartleby, are you [GM]Bartleby?

Also, congrats to Anand. A real statement match from him; none of the typical WC match draw happiness. He's been waiting for this ever since Kasparov retired - a WC match where he gets to be the hunter.

Anand's prep has been astonishing; Bilbao was clearly a painful experience, not being able to trot out the real stuff.

I would expect a real whitewash at Corus and Linares next year too based on what he's shown in Bonn.

Anand kramniks Kramnik. Nuff said.

Any inside news on why Anand did not give the press conference with Kramnik. As of current time, he still has not arrived at the conference and Kramnik has finished his and walked off.

Although I have been saying that Kramnik is by no means out, I have to admit that I don't see him coming back from this. He would have to shift his entire playing strategy and fit. I can see him winning one or two, but not 3 + tiebreaks.

The downside of having an elite GM as your second is the embarrassment of knowing he would have a better score against your opponent...

A comment here after Anand's 9. a3, a novelty.

"Anand wants to be the first who throws the TN at any costs. In this case and position the "novelty" is sort of worthless."

However, Dennis Monokroussos in his blog wrote:

"Anand's 9.h3 is a very interesting novelty. The point is obvious but no less strong for that: White wants to play g4. Black's queen will have problems finding a safe home."

Is castling obsolete?

I wonder how Kramnik won against Topalov after forfieting a game during last WCh. Here he looks a shadow of that Kramnik. Any suggesstions as to why the best match player of all time is getting his butt kicked..sorry battered. Toiletgate comes to mind. Hmm...

From the press conf question, it looks like the players individually (Kramnik going first) had to go through a drug test and hence the press conf. held separately.

@ elpresidente

> Bartleby, are you [GM]Bartleby?

I would prefer to be GM, but no, I'm not.

only way for anand to lose this: fail a drug test. anand, should have gone easy on that cigarette carsten hensel offered you :)

Who would argue that Kramnik is one of the greatest match players ever? Throughout the 1990's Kramnik's match career was distinguished by a lack of success, when he lost handily to Kamsky and Shirov. His reputation as a Match player was born with his defeat of Kasparov. I'm not sure that scrounging a draw in the last game of his match against Leko adds to that accomplishment; not counting the forfeit, he did manage to outpoint Topalov in the 11 games that were played in the "ToiletGate" match in Elista.

Sure, beating Kasparov--indeed keeping Garry winless for the entire match--was a great feat. Kramnik surely played well. But that result occurred due to Kasparov's psychological collapse when he encountered a trying situation.

We can surmise that the Kasparov match sowed the seeds for Kramnik's undoing, where he was rewarded by playing cautiously, and submitting to small disadvantages when playing Black. He could grind out wins with White against technically inferior players (although never enough to win many tournaments). The tiny edges that his White repetoire can provide are not really sufficient to gain serious winning chances against a player of Anand"s caliber.

And now Kramnik has cracked, losing 3 out of 4 games. So goes another well-cherished myth, that Kramnik has superior nerves. Allowing that Mate in 1 to Fritz ought to have been seen as a huge signal flare that all was not well with Vlad.

The Chess World is fortunate that Kramnik's claims to the WC title are now about over. The "Classical" Chess title now go to Anand, a worthy Champion. Given Anand's age, and an apparent decline in his dominance, his reign might end at the next cycle. And even before then, he'll still have to face the winner of the Topalov--Kamsky match (if it is ever held), who will undoubtedly display more fighting spirit than Kramnik has. Kamsky matches up well with Anand, and Topailov has always shown a lot of capacity to resist. Questions about the strength of Anand's nerves *in a Close Match* have not been resolved.

It is a real shame that a Kramnik--Anand match never took place in the late 1990's, or even within a couple of years after Kramnik took the title from Kasparov. THAT would have been the match which we were hoping that this would be.

"I wonder how Kramnik won against Topalov after forfieting a game during last WCh."

In one of the games, Topalov had a clear win and missed it. In another game, Topalov had a plus (not yet a clear win), blundered a pawn and went on to lose. In the latter game, I think Kramnik offered a draw and Topalov turned it down. If you imagine those 1.5 points in Toaplov's column, then the match likely turns out differently. Chess is not just about preparation, but also about judgment at the board.

But it's really remarkable that in 6 games, Anand hasn't even had to sweat. There've been 2 sterile draws, 1 draw in which Anand was better, and 3 wins for Anand.

Great game! Looks like Vishy has wrapped it up. At the same time, the games have been terrific. I'm happy that Kramnik has tried to fight. Vishy has outplayed him comprehensively so far, imo. The new computer age demands aggressive chess, which is up Anand's alley, as it is Kaspy's and Topa's. The Drawnik style cannot compete. Nice to see a fellow of the older generation prove his superiority. Maybe Chucky's still got a shot, but I doubt it. Next we'll see Anand-Topalov and that will be exciting, for sure.

I do think that Kramnik will finish with a win or two, but such a short match should be over. I think that Vishy has benefitted from his previously-poor match results and has outprepared Big Vlad for this match. But what a nice victory for chess so far. The games have been great. More please!!

"Who would argue that Kramnik is one of the greatest match players ever?"

Lots of people have argued that, over & over again. But I agree that it is a myth, born out of one indisputably great accomplishment, the victory over Kasparov. If you set that match aside, there is little in the rest of Kramnik's history to support this assertion.

Of course, I am not denying that beating Kasparov was a remarkable achievement. But it is best regarded as an isolated event, not as evidence that Kramnik is inherently better at match play than other comparably skilled players.

Wonder what Kramnik will say after the end of this match?

Its not a bad idea to be polite always. Ask Anand "May I borrow your crown for a while?, and he may actually give it.

@mz: ROTFL!!

Anand is displaying the Eye of the "Madras" Tiger! 18... c5 wasn't much of a mistake, but Anand made mincemeat of it. Wow, as cold as he was in the last tournament, he's hotter than fire now!

Any news about what Kramnik or Anand said at the press conference? I can't view it anywhere, is it being live-blogged anywhere on the net? thans

Wow... when a Topalov fan starts feeling sorry for VK then that tells
you something. That third loss today was the killer. That was too much
for much hope, it is still possible, but far less likely. And how it
happened is even more defining.

Looking at these games, I can't quite decide if Anand is super-strong
at the moment, or VK is just totally sub-par. Or both. It seems like a
match between 2800 vs. 2500 player. Regular positions get squeezed out
and at no time it even appeared dangerous for White today. Wild swings
tends to happen in Chess from time to time and winning/lossing streaks
take place, we've seen it in the past -- but in such a short match, I
can't quite see how this hole can be jumped out of.

Despite the one-sidedness, which looks like a poorly staged match that
should be terminated after 3 KO's, I still am very happy of the
overall direction. I feared that a Kramnik victory would have led us
right back into the abyss of unclear future, preferential treatments,
special requests, Zhukov, etc. Since 2000 VK thought that he inherited
GK's demi-God status and acted like it, but his results never quite
matched that height of sustained achievement and naturally there was a
rift. I got tired of this "Kramnik above all, above an entire
generation of players" attitude since he was the greatest match player
and owned the title and skillfully managed the challenges. But I hope
he gets back into the cycle next year, just like everybody else,
fights his way up, no more "divine ownership of the title" and
listening to the crazy justifications for it by some of his most avid
fans on this forum.

Well, enough already, I hope the match becomes more contested in the
second half.

D.

Doug:
I'm not sure about greatest match player ever (that's still Kasparov, I think), but not every champion can win and then successfully defend their title twice. I think beating Kasparov is indeed a feat. Look at their rating differential at the time -- and you can't chalk it all up to a Kasparovian "collapse." If that is indeed what happened (and I don't think it was), then there were multiple factors that created it, among them being Kr.'s immense preparation and psychological approach. The way you write it as what happened when K. encountered a "trying situation" makes it sound like he got stuck in traffic and couldn't play chess anymore.

Additionally, K. gets a distinction as a fantastic match player because his style is based on technique and constancy, qualities that are best suited to long-term duels where small advantages are precious.

I'm not sure I ever believed that his nerves were superior, just better than most of his opponents.

I doubt if Big Vlad will ever be able to get back on top, Dimi. His recent results have been quite poor, and his style is not conducive to winning big tournaments. Look at how Morozevich has been "owning" him of late! I have enjoyed watching many of Kramnik's games, but I'm glad he's off the top of the heap now. He has a tendency to be political and his match strategy is quite stale to us fans. I much prefer Vishy's enterprising style. He played this match like he wanted it more. We have been spoiled over the last few decades in that the world champion was arguably the greatest player of all time (Fischer-Karpov-Kasparov.) It is a little troubling that we can't quite make the same claim for Vishy, but he has proven to be a top player over a long period of time. He does deserve a spot on top of Olympus anyway. I do think that he is one of the top ten greatest players of all time; but it is a shame that he was never quite able to prove his superiority over Kasparov.

As a sidenote: My son's middlename is Anand. I named him after Vishy and after a prime minister of Thailand, whose first name was Anand. This was back in 1992 when he was born. Nice to see Anand as confirmed champion. I was one who was not willing to fully annoint him until he beat Kramnik in a match. Now he has. It's all good for Caissa!

Wow; That was a seemingly effortless show of power and mastery. I recommend an immediate check Anand's restroom for ceiling cables.

Anand has sweated significantly. Both of his Meran wins were tense affairs where Anand could easily have lost. That he did not is not a statement that once he left preparation he was playing effortlessly. He was not.

Even near the end of game 3, second best moves in a razor sharp position led to draws or advantage to White. Anand has worked hard for his wins; Kramnik has played well, and I object to the characterization of this match as "2800 vs. 2500". So far, Anand has been playing a lot better than that! Certainly the score doesn't entirely capture the close, tense struggles that have occurred. This is 2700+ chess all the way.

1. Steinitz
2. Lasker
3. Capablanca
4. Aljechin
5. Euwe
6. Botwinnik
7. Smyslow
8. Tal
9. Petrosjan
10. Spassky
11. Fischer
12. Karpov
13. Kasparov, 1985-2000
14. Kramnik, 2000-2008
15. Anand, 2008-

The only disputable thing is whether Anand got his title in 2007 or 2008.

Throughout all the questioning about Kramnik deserving the championship title, I have taken his side(not that it matters of course). Now he gets slaughtered in this fashion. Maybe history will look back on Kramnik as a faux champion during chaotic times akin to Kasim, Khalif, Topalov, etc. He really has played "poorly" in tournaments for a while, especially in non-technical positions. I guess this was different when he beat Kasparov. I hope Kramnik will be able to reinvent his chess and save his legacy. Please excuse these random words, I grew up reading Kramnik's best game collection with Damsky and this is like watching a fallen superhero. Meanwhile congrats to Anand, he has been the man to beat for years.

Anand after winning this match will become world champion under three different formats - Knock Out(2000), Tournament(2007), Match(2008) and add to this World Rapid champion(2003)

Only Botvinnik won under two formats Tournament and Match.

Anand will be a very unique world champion among all World champions.

>So goes another well-cherished myth, that Kramnik >has superior nerves. Allowing that Mate in 1 to >Fritz ought to have been seen as a huge signal >flare that all was not well with Vlad.

We have known for few good years that not all is well with Kramnik.
Maybe since 2002 or so he has started to lack the level of energy, incisiveness and sharpness required to play at top-level but he compensated by taking long breaks from tournament play and by shifting to exclusively technical, "no computations", play. He didn't play much better against Topalov, he just did nothinhg but fortunately for him Topa was so healthy and willing for activity that he managed to beat himself
Now his long agony is finally over. From now on he will play amateur chess with girls in simultaneous exhibitions, such thing doesn't require much stamina, Karpov can do that too.

My top ten:

1. Fischer
2. Kasparov
3. Capablanca
4. Karpov
5. Botvinnik
6. Lasker
7. Anand
8. Kramnik
9. Korchnoi
10. Alekhine

I did rank Bobby over Gary because I think Fischer would have thrived during the age of computers. He lived chess 14hrs/day. He would have been unstoppable.

Congratulations to Vishy Anand. Top-notch preparation, great accuracy at the board, no fears of any type, good time management. He really is a worthy World Champion.

Folks, let's not feel too bad for Kramnik. He's gonna make lots of money off this one. This match is his golden parachute.

It's over, my dear boys and girls.

Anand deserves it, though I never thought it's gonna be this fast. Pretty exciting though.

And the timing is right for Anand. The window between the Kasparov era and the upcoming Carlsen era. He never had a chance against Kaspy, and probably will be a little too old against Carlsen. It's now. And he did it.

"Plus, there is every reason to believe Anand will continue to outplay Kramnik." - GeneM

Kramnik doesn't play sharp chess post-illness (c.2003) because HE PROBABLY KNOWS HE CAN'T (at a 2790-level anyway, versus, say, a 2650-level.)

The red flag, as I've said repeatedly, is Nf8 Qh7++ (Deep Fritz 2006 match).

The exact same thing happened to Karpov in the mid-1990s - he suddenly started missing 1400-level tactics on occassion.

Age/illness kills off tactical acuity, and forces oldsters to live on positional knowledge.

It's also probably why Moro's starting to own him.

quote from HCL:
"Age/illness kills off tactical acuity, and forces oldsters to live on positional knowledge."
Ouch! That describes my situation.

IMO this match signals the end of Kramnik's 15-year run (1993-2008) as a contender or champion.

From now on he will be a positional Nigel Short, good to round out A-tournaments, and within a number of years, B-tournaments.

1. Steinitz 1886-1894
2. Lasker 1894-1921
3. Capablanca 1921-1928
4. Alekine 1928-1934
5. Euwe 1935-1937
Alekine 1937-1946
(Title Vacant) 1947
6. Botvinnik 1948-1957
7. Smyslov 1957-1958
Botvinnik 1958-1960
8. Tal 1960-1961
Botvinnik 1961-1963
9. Petrosian 1963-1969
10. Spassky 1969-1972
11. Fischer 1972-1975
12. Karpov 1975-1985
13. Kasparov 1985-2000
14. Kramnik 2000-2007
15. Anand 2007-

Oh, come on.

1. Kasparov
2. Karpov
3. Capablanca
4. Fischer
5. Botvinnik
6. Alekhine
7. Steinitz
8. Lasker
9. Anand
10. Kramnik

You can make an argument for Anand as high as #4, since Fischer was really only good for a couple of years here and there, but the top three are pretty clear in my opinion, in terms of long, dominant careers by world champions.

"Age/illness kills off tactical acuity, and forces oldsters to live on positional knowledge."

That was true even for Tal if you look at the "later"-games ( though he rationalized away as 'I did not know better when I was young")
Kramnik is still young at 33, it is health which is failing him badly.

I bet $1 that Kasparov is now more happy than Anand

Anand is back to #1 on Live ratings. Interesting that whenever Topalov disses someone as being lower rated be it Morozevich, Kramnik or Vishy they promptly overtake him.

pay attention folks, to an earlier post ! dont' psycho-analyze other people's minds, just respond to their posts.

Of course i knew an execuse wasnt being proffered...I too was making a tongue-in-cheek -response ...

sheez stop being so 'sensitive' guys

the main point of that post wasnt commented upon ! I predicted yesterday the score may well become -3 or -4 the more other openings/lines get played because it seemed to me Anand's this new aggressive incarnation must be tied to him having under his belt numerous novelties prepared for this match...today too Anand unleashed a good novelty at move 9 in trusted nimzo.

What the hell does Topalov get a shot at WC title now? The winner of Toap/Kamsky match has absolutely no business challenging the WC. Topa didn't even play in the WC 07 tournament. He lost a match to Kramnik. He has no standing whatsoever. A garbage tournament was held which Kamsky won. Topa didn't even have to play in that tournament. He directly gets to play with the winner, and then with the WC! The official line is that Topa is given this because he is a "former world champion". Come again? There are half a dozen former world champions. So all of them get a free shot at being the WC after beating the winner of a small tournament? And suppose Anand were to lose to Topalov in their match, Anand will become a former world champion, so he will get a free match with Topa again? This is nonsense. They should start a qualification cycle right now. The winner of that cycle plays with the winner of this match. Then the cycle repeats. End of story.

It's going to be nice having another briefly undisputed WC.

Of course, it will only last until Anand "agrees" to trade in his 120-year-old championship title for a tournament trophy (and doesn't win), at which point half the chess public will once again refuse to acknowledge the loss and require him to lose it the traditional way, and the other half will insist that Anand gets to decide what "World Champ" means, it can be a tournament medal if he wants.

In the meantime, it'll be nice to stop the bickering.

If this were a 24-game-match, Kaspys 2850 record would be in danger.

>Toledo Paul | October 21, 2008 2:32 PM | Reply
>I doubt if Big Vlad will ever be able to get back on top,
> Dimi. His recent results have been quite poor, and his style is
> not conducive to winning big tournaments.

Paul, people's styles change as a result of outside stimuli.
Obviously VK is a hugely talented player and I am sure that once
he rids himself of that "I beat GK, everything I do is great"
mental state he'll be a great player again. Look how in 2006 he
came out of nowhere and won just about everything he played and
with a great resulting rating.

So, don't discard anyone. As far back as January, 2007 in Corus,
people where wondering if Anand still has it within him to be a
Champ. Then he pushed up. Then Topalov was written off and he
might as well kick the door to the Top again. I'm sure this is
not the last we've heard from Kramnik either.

So, just enjoy the Chess and the fact that nobody knows what will
happen, but one thing is certain and by far the greatest thing
that will come out of this match if the results holds is that the
Title is Unified. It was unified on paper in Elista, but as long
as Kramnik was a factor it was still cursed by GK's 1993 split
and that line of claims. When in control, Kramnik always felt
unpredictable. Everything was in the air, like chasing a weasel
in the dark Russian steppes... Anyway, after this match it will
be cemented behind a 9 feet wall.

And no more the nonsense that one is good in matches, but not in
tournaments and the match is the better format, etc, all talk
that became relevant only to explain Kramnik's state... If one is
good and when one is in form all formats should work well...

D.

>I bet $1 that Kasparov is now more happy than >Anand

briefly, for a second, the next one he is back to his ongoing resentement because at the level Karamnik plays now Kaspy could beat him easily even if retired..arghh..

I think it's amusing how everyone seems to assume that once Anand wins this, & presumably beats Topalov (if that happens, if the match happens, if T beats Kamsky...), he'll roll over & die against Carlsen. The old boy might just show the kid a trick or two or many. One thing's for sure: Vishy deserves his moment(s) in the sun, & there's a promise of him retaining it for quite awhile, IMHO.

"The greatest match player of modern era" now has a =0 match record since 2000, that's omitting the forfeited Game 5 to Topalov.

He has a +1-1=2 record in classical chess matches since 2000.

Both stats omit his much inferior play in matches up to that point.

And for anybody who says "everyone can have one bad match," how much of Kramnik's claim to being "The greatest match player of modern era" is based on "one good match" against Kasparov?

YK, a Kramnik fan

Kramnik I think went wrong in the selection of his seconds. Leko is good on paper but perhaps not complementing Kramnik's strengths.

If Anand finishes this match with two draws and a win (for a +4 match victory), he'll -

1). Become/continue being World Champion.

2). Regain/retain(he's already #1 at this time and will be #1 even if he finishes 'only' on +3) the #1 ranking.

3). Go past 2800 again (2801.4 to be exact).

I don't think he should waste time on another match with Topalov/Kamsky. He should focus on getting a million dollar match against Rybka, prepare for 6 months, win, and retire after that match. There would be nothing else left to motivate him after that..

>I don't think he should waste time on another match with Topalov/Kamsky. He should focus on getting a million dollar match against Rybka, prepare for 6 months, win, and retire after that match. There would be nothing else left to motivate him after that >

Strange mentality for an Anand-fan. You sound as if you want him dead and burried or at least certainly not wanting and not playing chess anymore.
I hope he will still play against top GMs and show them tricks and tactical swindles while in his 60s.

Post-game update of the main item.

As usual with big deficits, how they got there is as important as the deficit itself. If one team is up 3-0 in football at the half it's usually because that team is better. A final score of 4-0 or 5-0 is more likely than 3-3, at least in football. But since we know how strong Kramnik is at his best, we can imagine a scenario in which he snaps out of his malaise and makes a decent run at a comeback. Abrupt changes of form really aren't that common in modern chess unless your name is Morozevich or Shirov. If he had another 14 games to play he could stay with his style of chess and still have a shot if his form returned. Winning three of six is another matter altogether.

But guys who play as solidly as Kramnik have only a mathematical chance of doing that against a top-10 player. I think he's won more than three games in a tournament only once in the past five years. Trying to force it probably won't work. Still, I hope he tries, could make things exciting. That is, for everyone and not just Anand fans, who are clearly excited enough already!

Btw, as I mentioned yesterday, both Korchnoi (against Karpov) and Karpov (against Kasparov) made up a three-point difference in six games or fewer in WCh matches. So not only is a mathematically possible, it's been done more than once. The difference there was how both streaks came very late in very long matches. Hard to see Vishy tiring or losing focus in this sprint.

Who wants to read my comment from September 23, 2007 12:13 on this page: http://www.chessninja.com/dailydirt/2007/09/leko_lives.htm :P

Anyone who followed GM commentary or GM/IM out there can you please comment on:
After 29. Ke1 (which was possibly to avoid knight fork on e3), was it possible for Kramnik to try for repetition with 29. ….. Rc2 Kd1 Rc8 Rc2 etc…?

Or was it that — it was possible but Kramnik chose to try for a win?

Nobody wants Kramnik to curl up and die. I hope he hasn't just given up and draws his way outta the match. Give him your best shot Vlad!! Show us what you're made of!

Does anyone else think that "live ratings" are sort of silly? Surely the very frequency that the #1 spot changes hands suggests it's not really measuring anything worth knowing.

Hey Mig, any word from Kasparov on game 6?

Theorist - quite.

In the recent US election debate one channel ran a graphic onscreen underneath the candidates; the graphic alleged to track *in real-time* the sentiment of undecided voters, oscillating up or down in reaction to the candidates' words.

I hated it and yet ... couldn't ... stop ... looking ...

if Anand wins, he has to play against Kasparov to finally gain the real unified title. Only a win over Kasparov would give Anand the credibility of the great World Champions.

Kasparov's retired, get over it. I'm a HUGE Kasparov fan and think that he could whip any of these guys if he got serious again and practiced for about a year, but that ain't happening. So, Anand is the legitimate WC. Kramnik agreed to such when he agreed to Mexico and this match.
'Nuff said! Personally I'm enjoying this even though I wanted Kramnik to win! I think Kramnik deserves this drubbing for having dodged Kasparov in a rematch.

Kramnik is KAPUT, he is being squashed like the punk he is. Never gave Kasparov a rematch, what a coward, then barely DRAWS Leko and beats Topalov by the slimmest margin and now is getting a can of whoop ass opened all over his chicken sh** playing style, love it especially all you Krumniks thinks there is still ANY chance LOL keep hoping losers

a match with Kasparov would rocket Anand in the sky when he wins. Why? Because Anand has Angst ( FEAR ) against Kasparov. Only in such a game he could prove that his personality matches his chess skills and legitimate him in the olymp of chess

Some thoughts...

It appears talk of classical match champion, tournament champion, etc will be mute if Anand maintains this result, which will be nice. I'm sure 100 years from now, all the schism of this era will be debated, reinterpreted, and partially forgotten in myth.

Looking at the live rating list and seeing Kramnik falling out of the top of the pack with the rest of the 2700+ GMs looks weird, but as we've seen with Ivanchuk and Morozevich, anyone on a hot streak can climb back up to the top of the ratings chart. Maybe Kramnik will make a run of it again instead of taking a step away from chess after these recent results (tournament and match).

If Topalov can win his match (deserved or undeserved), we are definately in for a treat with Anand vs Topalov... two players who are really in good overall playing shape. Would be nice to see a longer match of 16 games for that, but surely things will be much shorter. :(

Nice job by Anand... maybe Carlsen is helping him out... making Anand more aggressive in his preparation. :)

What's with this "giving a a rematch" business? This is not boxing, guys. You just can't arbitrarily decide who has to play with who how many times. A beats B in a WC match. Now why is A supposed to give a "rematch" to B? What if B beats A in that match? Now they are 1-1, and there will be a third match to decide the "real" winner? What about others? This is the recipe for chaos, which is what we have had for a decade.

If A beats B in a WC match, A is the WC and B goes back in the candidate pool with all others. It's over. Then there is a candidates cycle and the winner, whoever he is, gets to play with A. We don't want Don King deciding who gets how many rematches with whom. Chess != Boxing.

It was not only that he mis-sacrificed a pawn. Such things happen.
It was how he reacted. He kept on pressing like there was no tomorrow.
He must have realised that the pawn won't come back.
He should have put up tough resistance, and fight for the draw.
Maybe the position was lost objectively already, but fight is what you do.
Maybe it's because I don't understand the position like he does, but to me it looked like he deliberately shunned the defensive fight for the measly draw, and pressed on nevertheless, hoping to topple Anand with a lucky punch.
Irrational, anti-Kramnikian.

I for one want it deleted. I would like to see any books written on how people show their most vulgar side on the internet. I would further like to see such people in person. I wonder what kind of life you lead, dana white, and if you can approach anything Kramnik has done in thought or deed. By all means root against him but some civility is required- not asked- of you.

Smyslov, too, made up a 3-point deficit quickly in his 1954 match vs. Botvinnik. He lost games 1 and 2, drew game 3, and lost game 4. Not a great start. After draws in games 5 and 6, he won game 7, drew game 8, and won games 9, 10, and 11 to take the lead. (The final score was 12-12.) So it's possible. Still, speaking as a Kramnik fan, I just don't see it happening in this case. A 4.5-1.5 lead is obviously much more significant in a race to 6.5 than in a race to 12.5. And I really can't picture Anand, playing as he is, losing three games in such a short span. He's come to this match "loaded for bear", as the saying goes, and it shows. All credit to him.

I vote for keeping the dana white post. He, she, or it is Exhibit A in the "Kramnik-haters are morons" argument.

But very impressive is the classiness of most of the Anand-fans and even some of the Topalov-fans in Vlad's darkest hour.

TWIC shows Anand's performance rating for these six games as 2965, and Vlad in his darkest hour (thanks Greg!) at 2590.

Interestingly Anand didn't castle in any of three wins! Is he on to something ;)

>Ellrond | October 21, 2008 5:56 PM | Reply
>a match with Kasparov would rocket Anand in the sky when he
>wins. Why? Because Anand has Angst ( FEAR ) against Kasparov. Only in
>such a game he could prove that his personality matches his chess
>skills and legitimate him in the olymp of chess

Jeez, shouldn't he also play against Fischer? Capablanka? Karpov? Who
else? Steinitz? Oh, Spaski is alive.

ellrond, I must tell that in a period of 2 years of observation nobody
matches your excellence in stupidity. You always find a way to improve
on your previous achievements.

D.

In the immortal words of Al Bundy (while winning the senior olympics) - He's not beating Big Bad Vlad..he's KILLING him...hahahhahahahah

Actually Fischer wanted to play Anand.

http://www.thechessdrum.net/blog/?p=137

I'm hoping Anand will close the deal on this and win at least one more. That way there won't be any doubt.

Unfortunately Kramnik will fade away after this. He can redeem himself at the Olympiad if he plays.

One more to go for that record... That was 4 touchdowns for Polk High.

Hey guys, this is SHOCK and AWE campaign!!! How do you like that?

very good post by Bartleby :

"It was not only that he mis-sacrificed a pawn. Such things happen.It was how he reacted. He kept on pressing like there was no tomorrow...irrational, anti-Kramnikian."

yes, Vlad seems to have lost balance and reason in this match. In general not only in this game, why playing knowingly right into your opponent's
8..a6 sharp home-prepation ?
Even the c5 mis-sacrifice of today is not what an experienced player does when cramped and under-pressure. Kramnik lost patience and did a thematic "freeing" move but regardless if it worked or not, as if he was playing poker and he was bluffing, and he continued on the same vein (ie. he kept on pressing without reason afterwards).

For all the euphoria of the Anand fans this not a success of Anand, it is more a personal catastrophe for Kramnik, as the score shows.

Maybe Anand should consider playing the Olympiad after all..Sasikiran has suddenly gained a whole bunch of points cross 2710..but then, the Indian team doesn't have any other top GM apart from Harikrishna..realistically the Indian team doesn't even have medal prospects, let alone gold..so maybe a vacation is more in order to please his wife who has sacrificed so much for this match prep..

Extremely impressive has been the hurry with which Kramnik fans have been willing ditch him in his 'darkest hour'

"Now his long agony is finally over. From now on he will play amateur chess with girls in simultaneous exhibitions, such thing doesn't require much stamina.."

Despite the clamor of his 'fans' asking for "money back", I don't blame Kramnik at all. By and large, except for the one egregious blunder (Nxd5), it has not been a case of Kramnik losing but Anand winning. I would dare say, with the form Anand has shown, none of the active players might have survived. Clearly, the Anand that Kramnik prepared for (1. e4 guy) is not the Anand who showed up for this match! It has been a double whammy ... on the one hand Kramnik has had no chance to show yet his preparations, and on the other hand he has been forced to contend with Anand's own preparations. Even so, Kramnik valiantly tried his best, came up with good moves most of the times in response to the novelties, but that effort alone extracted its price in the subsequent parts of the game. That would have been the case for anyone in the same situation, perhaps even Kasparov (as it did happen to him in their WCC). But relatively everyone dwelt much on Kasparaov, and more on Kramnik's win. The right response.

So I prefer to positively accept the fact that Anand has been playing a superlative game, and only in relation to that awesome display does Kramnik's show has been poor. So well tried Kramnik, VERY WELL DONE ANAND !

I just read MIG's own statements that support what I posted above.

"ANAND HAS PLAYED SUPERLATIVELY IN EVERY PHASE OF THE GAME. (Lest we pile too much scorn on Kramnik's doorstep.)"

My point too!

Evidently MIG accepts this is a success of Anand, as indeed the score shows !!!!!

It is interesting how much Anand has modified his playing style for this match, while Kramnik has more or less stuck to his. Anand used to blitz out moves, going an hour ahead on the clock. Now he uses all his time, even if he got an initial time advantage out of his opening prep. Even more obvious is his switching to 1.d4. Kramnik in contrast has not done much to surprise Anand and has become a sitting target. In these matches you have to play out of your skin, stretch your game while not letting go of your natural strengths.

So, contra Bartleby's and Ovidiu's criticism of "anti-Kramnikian" play, I think Kramnik has made the opposite mistake of not shaking up his game to get more winning chances. He may have now realized the need to do something special, and might look more 'un-Kramnikian' in the remaining games.

>It is interesting how much Anand has modified >his playing style for this match.

Nobody, except you, has noticed any "change of style" in the case of Anand. He plays tactical as he always did and, as expected, he has prepared sharp and aggressive variations. 1.d4 was predicted by many because otherwise he would lose White to Kramnik's Petroff (Toplaov also used only 1.d4 for the same reason).

Anand plays as Anand, Kramnik play however is poor and sometimes suicidal (except game 4 which was too short to blunder something).

I vote to keep the Dana White post too. A post by a female blogger on a chess forum is a rarity.

Ovidiu:

1.d4 may have been predicted by some, but please explain how it is not a major change in Anand's game if he switches from 1.e4 to 1.d4? Actually nobody except you pretends to have known about it all along. Here are Aronian's comments on Game 2 (via chessbase):

`Of course we all can pretend that it was an "expected surprise" and that Anand's choice of opening did not make us believe, for one moment, that there is something wrong with the live broadcast. But reality is: Anand has come to Bonn to win, and he is willing to take risks by employing lines he never did before.'

That chessbase article starts:

`Vishy Anand surprised his opponent Vladimir Kramnik – and the world – with the move 1.d4 in his first white game of the World Championship in Bonn.'

It is obvious Anand has neutralized a major part of Kramnik's preparation which would have been geared towards 1.e4. Can you point to any way in which Kramnik has tried to surprise Anand?

This was written on Oct 8

ANAND-KRAMNIK PREVIW - Artur Jussupow

EXCERPTS

"In top chess the preparation for the opening has by now gained such great importance that it might be compared with the service in tennis. And therefore the player who prepares more skilfully and can provide more surprises in the opening game may be the winner" ....

"Anand has found the necessary inner balance – and he is at the peak of his chess career."

"the world championship is not decided by chess-playing abilities alone. Other factors will play an important part: good physical condition, clever match strategy, motivation, the right team of seconds, better preparation – not least of all, their form during the contest."

And finally, somewhat laughably, he rated how they would fare on various categories, of which

Opening preparation: Anand 9; Kramnik 10.

oh well ... it was an understandable rating, not that much different for both players. But so far it has turned out more like Anand 10; Kramnik 1

We can easily visualize the genuine surprise and shock Anand's opening preparation and novelties must have come to watching GMs and above all to Kramnik himself.

On Oct 4, in an interview with Der Spiegal, Anand replies as follows:

PIEGEL: How did you prepare for the World Championship?

Anand: I have been studying Kramnik since the end of April, up to ten hours a day, here at home in my cellar, where I have my office. I have a database and construct game plans. I try to neutralise positions in which Kramnik is strong.

He is doing the same thing with my game, which I must of course take into consideration. [HMMM..DID HE?}

Let me put it this way: I must remember that he is thinking about what I am thinking about him.

In any case one is working for months with the computer, trying to find new paths.

"I try to neutralize positions in which Kramnik is strong." In another pre-match interview, Anand said he remembers more than 95% of ALL of Kramnik's games and can relate any position from his games if shown to the exact game instantly.

So...Anand has certainly delivered on what he said he was doing by way of preparation.

As for Kramnik, only he can be forthcoming and explain what he thinks really happened. That would be the most authentic version, straight from the horse's mouth.

The first online comment on that Der Spiegal interview is interesting:

"As usual Anand manages to say absolutely nothing of any interest." !!!!

In retrospect, Anand revealed the essence of his strategy in that interview, I would say !!

Bobby Fischer is the most hyped human chess player. He was one of the strongest human players no doubt, but he was not way above his peers. And let's not forget that he chickened out of the world championship match with Karpov.

The thing that is special about Bobby is that he essentially learned to play on his own whereas almost all of his peers were products of the soviet chess factory.

Is Kramnink going to send an SOS to all Russian GMs ?

Will "not castling" become a fad among club-players after the match ?

Will Kramnik cut Leko's pay based upon Variable Performance Pay method ? :)

I will not recognise any world champion unless he plays and defeats Alekhine ( who was the last undefeated world champion ).So all of you who want an undisputed world champion, ( in these days when anyone with a keyboard but without any brain cells can post on blogs ) better start trying to resurrect Alekhine.

As stated in http://www.chessninja.com/dailydirt/2007/09/tour-de-vish.htm

It's not over till it's over, but it's over.

Unfortunate that Humpy lost earlier this year in the womens WCC. If she had won India would have had the rare distinction of winning the boys junior, girls junior, men senior and women senior world champions in one year!

No I don't think that Kramnik should play in the Olympiad! He needs rest and recuperation not more chess. I'm not sure about Anand either. Last time he lost some 20 elo points after his debacle.

This is the first time after Kasparov that World Champion is playing against a worthy opponent. If you look at the Jeff Sonas Chessmetrics Summary -page it's quite easy to see that these two have been close, but Anand has been better player most of their active career and clearly the most talented player of "their generation". Kramnik was dominating a short period of 2001-2003.

The result is only doing justice to Anand, for not being able to play for the title.

It's a pity Sonas stopped updating the Chessmetrics site after 2005. I have always felt it was the best way to account for rating inflation over time and to truly do justice to a player's *playing strength* independent of the historical vagaries of the World Title process (especially with respect to whether or not a universally accepted process existed - as has been the case since 1993).

I remember a brief exchange with Russianbear on this subject last year (I am mostly a lurker - but see link below) where I said that history would judge Anand and Kramnik at the end of their careers to both rank somewhere between # 6 and #10 among the all time greats, with Anand marginally higher due to longevity and consistency (look at the rankings with expanding time windows on the site). He objected of course (based on his much higher regard for matches), but given the vagaries of the opportunity to play matches - I am a big fan of the chessmetrics ratings.

http://www.chessninja.com/dailydirt/2007/09/whats-in-a-name.htm#comments

Mig - can you or anyone else persuade Sonas to update these ratings?

Kramnik exposed! Now it is obvious why he avoided another match with Kasparov so assidiously.

Carlsen must be delighted. Now he knows he will be able to have a crack at the Title before the age of about 30 without being screwed around by a guy who avoids the strongest player while still claiming to be Champion.

Provided that in the future neither FIDE nor anyone else gives Kramnik special favours, Kramnik will never be Challenger or Champion again.

GM I.Rogers' comment on 6th:

...Kramnik made a half-hearted pawn sacrifice, Anand took it, and the rest seemed to be just a matter of technique for the Indian. 
After the game.. Kramnik could not even identify where his position had gone downhill - he thought his position was fine but his judgment, once the rock upon which his games were founded, proved fallible. 
..Karpov was admiring of the accuracy of Anand's play but opined that the match was being lost by Kramnik, rather than won by Anand.
...Anand, meanwhile, looked more relieved than elated. The 38-year-old Indian had previously blown a two point lead in a Candidates Match against Gata Kamsky but three points up is a different matter. The rest of the match should be a coronation, unless Kramnik pulls off the greatest revival since Lazarus.  

If this was a prize fight, Id say it is almost time to throw in the towel... Kramnik is taking a beating. Anand is battering Kramnik with black pieces, with white pieces, with queens on the board and with queens off the board. However the battle is not over yet; the second half of the match has yet to begin. And for Kramnik this will be the most important game 7 in his post Kasparov chess career. The only question left for Anand is will his gentle nature allows him to continue punish and crush the spirit of Kramnik who Anand regards as friend off the board. I think at this point, Anand will be content to draw the remaining games.

>However the battle is not over yet; the second >half of the match has yet to begin.

It is over, it was over before it started. Karmnik's troubles look deep : he has serious problems of judging positions objectively and lacks the energy to keep it focused all the time (gets tired after a while and blunders, almost each game).

That's not the kind of troubles that can be fixed in 2 days ( except if he starts takingh drugs, as amphetamine and the like, to aritficially boost his ill system)

i disagree with those who say that the match is over: it is not. as everybody says Anand has the win seal (barring major dissasters) but now the objectives have changed: Anand will try to "humiliate" Kramnik (in the sporting sense of course) and score an almost Fischerian 4:0 or 5:0. Kramnik on the other hand will try to regroup and maybe close the gap a bit. a say 3:1 score wouldn't be too bad he could always says that simply his preparation in the Meran was bad.

"The result is only doing justice to Anand, for not being able to play for the title."

Anand did play for the title, just at a time when Gary was an obvious monster and Anand still green.

One more win and Anand will approach Fischer territory - something like his win over Petrosian. But rather like Spassky, who started playing well once it was "obvious" he was going to lose, Kramnik still can try to win at least one game.

Jean: "Anand will try to 'humiliate' Kramnik (in the sporting sense of course) and score an almost Fischerian 4:0 or 5:0."

Too late! The Fischer matches against Taimanov and Larsen really were 6-0 and 6-0, and Anand "only" is ahead in this match 4.5-1.5.

Anand!
Universal player.
Kramnik slayer.
When it is your move you are not a delayer.
From the path to victory you are not a strayer.
So much more than a mere Rybka relayer.
Your opponents do not have a prayer.
Anand!
Universal player.

It's amazing to see how many patzers can spit on a guy they would never get a draw against, would they be given the opportunity to play one million games against him.

Anand is a great player and a deserving world champion. Kramnik was a fantastic world champion. Both are also gentlemen, and friends. I'm quite certain that after the match you'll see Kramnik smile like a gentleman and congratulate his friend for his title.

Maybe you - idiots - who are opposing them ignore the very elementary fact that they've been friends for 20 years.

Fischer-Petrosian seems a reasonable comparison, but Petrosian won the second game of the Candidates match. Anand has surpassed that result. Anand-Topalov would be an interesting match, since they have tended to split classical time games. Garry out of retirement would be worth a few $million.

Ruslan wrote: "Both are also gentlemen, and friends."

Kramnik said after mexico: "at present, I take the view that I have just lent Anand the title temporarily"

Well,what else can I say?Now it is very evident:the "Classical Champion" who avoided at any price new matches against Kasparov and Topalov,who only drew after a big effort his match against Leko,who did not show up in San Luis 2005,who won in Elista with a highly dubious behaviour and played in Mexico 2007 only after recieving an unprecedented favour by FIDE gets what he deserves.An average GM at the moment was allowed to play for the title once again for no reason an we see the results:a one sided match between 2 players of different levels.

Kramnik is a top level GM, one of the five strongest players in the world (Anand, Topalov, Aronian, Carlsen) over the past two years, and probably the #1 player from 2000-2003.

He is far from done; even bad match defeats don't necessarily doom a career. Kasparov got whitewashed in 2000, but came back with some of the best tournament results of his career.

Kramnik is a bit older than Anand in 1995, but he has good years left. Don't write him off just because he's losing badly to the best player in the world. Anand has been preparing for a match like this for thirteen years, and for eight of them, he's been pretty sure he'd face Kramnik eventually.

Words of inspiration from the Outlaw Josey Wales:

"Now remember, things look bad and it looks like you're not gonna make it, then you gotta get mean. I mean plumb, mad-dog mean. 'Cause if you lose your head and you give up then you neither live nor win. That's just the way it is."

We were all fifteen-year-olds once, I guess. Chris B. will grow out of it eventually. If we're lucky he'll find a girlfriend and will put those raging hormones to better use.

Again, confusing my support for match format of the WC title with support for Kramnik. It gets old, you know. As much as I dislike Anand I am almost relieved Anand is on the verge of winning it because finally a guy everyboody knows I dislike might become the champ so I don't have to deal with the "RB supports matches because he likes the guy who is holding the match title (or because the guy holding the match title is Russian)" nonsense, that is usually accompanied by a good dose of personal attacks. Though I can imagine people calling me a rabid Anand supporter. Logic has never been a big factor in these things.

If someone is rabid, it is you, Chris B. The top level chess' was rid of its main divisive virus - or a cancer if you will- years ago, largely by Kramnik's efforts in the 2000 match. The more you dump on Kramnik, the worse you make your guy Kasparov look. It has been 8 years, it is time to advance past the denial stage and admit Kramnik won because he was the better player in 2000. Learn to give credit where credit is due. Watch me, a "rabid" Kramnik fan say that very thing about Anand right after Anand beats Kramnik in this match. "Rabid" or not, I will be more gracious towards Anand minutes after his win than you have been to Kramnik even years after the fact. "Rabid" is as rabid does. I am afraid my rabidness will be nowhere near as big as yours.

Greg really does seem to have some sort of obsession about fifteen-year-old boys...
Ain't legal, you know, Greg.

Chris B.
You have absolutely no class.

Anybody else notice in the post match press conference, for the first time Anand is smiling and joking with the reporters?

Previously he had a all business look, and it was Kramnik that was joking and making light hearted comments, even after going down -2.

This is still a tense struggle, and if Anand relaxes just a bit there is still a chance to let Kramnik into the match. I think Anand knows this. That's why he expressed happiness on 2 or 3 occasions in the game 6 press conference that there was a rest day coming up.

Anyway, I have a lot of respect for Kramnik for his behavior. I can't imagine it was easy to even show up for the press conference. After what happened today a lesser player may have thrown a tantrum and started pointing fingers.

While Anands lead is impressive, assuming he wins he will not be the real world champion in my eyes until he beats Karpov in a match.

RussianBear: The more you dump on Kramnik, the worse you make your guy Kasparov look.

Oh, please, that tired line again... Desperate shots at Kasparov when
you know that he is not Kramnik's problem today. Listen, no matter
what Russianbear things, as well as "Kramnik Central" on this forum
(unusually quiet these days), GK will remain many, many miles ahead in
the annals of Chess history. Placing those two players side by side is
kinda of ridiculous. Kasparov was never a weasel, never! On the
contrary one might call him too adventurous. Kramnik was an
exceptionally calculative weasel who knew that he very rarely shared
Kasparov's position at the top of Chess and thus preferred to play
slippery most of time. You can't hide that simple fact behind all
kinds of technicalities and minutiae.

BTW, refusing now that you're an ardent Kramnik fan and that has
colored your entire approach to Chess history is somewhat like Peter
denying to know Him 3 times before first crows when he was down. Not
very convincing.

Kramnik will be back, no doubt -- I just can do fine without the lines
of "who borrowed His Title" for awhile. Until he climbs his way back
and borrows the title again in a legitimate and predictable format.

D.

Kramnik has the potential to be a serious story in chess history, but at present he's more of a Petrosian or Smyslov level figure; at best, Botvinnik without the legions of students.

Yet, he is in his early thirties, and has at least a productive decade and a half before serious rating and form declines are likely to take him out of the Linares crowd.

I expect to see him qualify for a World Championship match again.

What drugs were they tested for? Can somebody tell me which are these drugs? I want to use them at least become the champion of my city?

"as Kramnik's career comes to a humiliating end in under a week"..

He made a lot of money out of that Kaspy-2000 success. Even now he makes a lot, very productive humiliation.
The only suckers in this comedy are the chessbuffs. Kramnik may have known for months that his health was poor and he was not able to put a fight but he kept it silent so as the interest for the "contest" to reamin hugh (and the sponsors and their money to remain too ).
He may have even considered the worst case : that he would not be able to at least save face (not able lose at only -1 or -2) but even in this case it was clearly still worth it.

"Just curious... can you please tell us why do you dislike Anand so much?"

You are new, I see. Why don't you hit the archives. Or you can read the comments to the Game 5 blog entry for a short recap.

"Listen, no matter what Russianbear things, as well as "Kramnik Central" on this forum
(unusually quiet these days), GK will remain many, many miles ahead in the annals of Chess history. Placing those two players side by side is
kinda of ridiculous. Kasparov was never a weasel, never! On the contrary one might call him too adventurous. Kramnik was an exceptionally calculative weasel who knew that he very rarely shared Kasparov's position at the top of Chess and thus preferred to play slippery most of time. You can't hide that simple fact behind all kinds of technicalities and minutiae."

I doubt even the rabidest of Kramnik fans ever said Kramnik was superior to Kasparov as far as career accomplishments go. I'll be the first to admit Kasparov is the greatest ever - and I am a Karpov fan. So don't pretend like acknowledging Kramnik's superiority to Kasparov once Kasparov was past his prime is equivalent to denying Kasparov's accomplishments.

As for being a weasel, Kasparov could give any other top players -be it Kramnik or anyone else- queen odds at the game of weaseling and have a decent shot at winning.

"BTW, refusing now that you're an ardent Kramnik fan and that has colored your entire approach to Chess history is somewhat like Peter denying to know Him 3 times before first crows when he was down. Not very convincing."

Don't make it sound like I am just starting to say it now. I've always made it clear I am not a Kramnik fan. It is just that you and some other rabid anti-Kramnik folks happen to take my support for match tradition and my objective take on Kramnik as some sort of hardcore support. If I rooted against your guy Topalov in Elista, it is only because Topalov made such a huge ass out of himself with his pre-match comments and especially his behaviour during the match, that it was implossible for all but a very tiny group of Topalov die-hards to root for any result other than a Topalov loss.

Sorry, but most people who accuse me of being a hardcore Kramnik supporter have it wrong. Kramnik has ended Kasparov world championship run, unified the title by beating Topalov in Topalov's prime and that doesn't make him popular with fans of those two popular players. Just because I defended the classical title it may have appeared I defended Kramnik to some hardcore supporters of players other than Kramnik, but if Anand doesn't fall apart, perhaps you should start saying how I've always been a rabid Anand fan, because I will be as pro-matches if Anand becomes the champ as I was before.

Words of inspiration from the Outlaw Josey Wales:

"Now remember, things look bad and it looks like you're not gonna make it, then you gotta get mean. I mean plumb, mad-dog mean. 'Cause if you lose your head and you give up then you neither live nor win. That's just the way it is."

Looks like Danailov was reading up his outlaws last year.

Mig:"..both Korchnoi (against Karpov in 78) and Karpov (against Kasparov in 86) made up a three-point difference in fewer than six games in WCh matches. (Coincidentally both lost in the end.) So not only is a mathematically possible, it's been done more than once."

Instead of wasting time on giving false hope to Kramnik fans, why don't you dig up something on most one-sided routs in WC matches?!

Prantik, I did answer your question in my message that is two messages above yours. I may not have given a direct answer but I have given you a place where you can easily find it, and I don't feel like retyping and copy/pasting something I've stated many times already.

>Don't make it sound like I am just starting to say it now. I've
>always made it clear I am not a Kramnik fan. [...] If I rooted
>against your guy Topalov in Elista, it is only because Topalov made
>such a huge ass...

Ok, RB, Now Topalov is at your sights -- I see, you're shooting Scuds
all over the map now like Saddam in his last days. Of course, you
forgot to say that the cheating provocations and the crazy
psychological campaign against Topalov started long before Elista, by
certain Bareev (he is on tape). But that's not the place or time to
rehash that ugly past again.

The bottom line is that I don't really care actually who you're a fan
of, but since you had something "nice" to say for each one of them
Kasparov, Topalov, and finally Anand (after Mexico), you leave us with
few choices. No, I've heard the "match tradition" justification for a long
time, but don't play coy with us, please, there is a plethora of other
comments that show what is what. And yes (from a previous exchange --
you asked, how does someone even know whether you're even Russian :-)
-- well, imagine that -- it leaves little to the imagination of what
nationality you're. Same thing about the "Kramnik uber alles" approach
of recent months/years.

But Ok, since VK is on his way out, the argument is getting pointless
now, so let's assume that you're a purely pro-match fan and a newly
adopted fan of Anand. Congratulations!

And as I said, VK will be back and I hope he plays within the
established framework. For the strong of the day any format should work fine.

D.

P.S. Hey Clubfoot you tried to address me in a previous message, but
as long as you write like a dull dud, there's little to comment
on. Try harder.

I don't understand one thing.How come,on earth,is possible,for player rated 2760+ ELO ,to miss MATE IN ONE in a slow time control chess game?That thing happend to V.Kramnik in 2006 match against Deep Fritz (computer program).From that point on I knew that he can't be worthy chess champ.He was sick,or drunk or something else at the time?What??
Simply I can't find excuse for not seeing mate in 1 for player calling himself world chess champ!Occasionally top players in time trouble blunder a piece (but they resign before checkmate always).Ponomariov once let Adams to checkmate him,but he played to the end despite seeing mate coming (for the audience).I will never understand how Vladimir couldn't see the mate treat when me ,patzer 1300 points lower rated than him,saw it.Can anybody explain that??That's all what I wanna say folks.Kramnik didn't disgraced only himself ,he disgraced whole humanity then.That's why I'm glad Anand is kicking his butt.I wish very much to see more of that HARD butt kicking .

Nice. People are getting all hot and sweaty. This poo-flinging side-show is sometimes the most exciting part in chess.

I don't know why russianbear has to be so convoluted. I'm new, so I don't know what russianbear's positions have been in the past. But currently he seems to be saying that all he/she/it cares about is (1) there should be an undisputed, unified world champion, and (2) the champion should be decided using a match format.

I don't know why russianbear cares so much about these two points. I mean caring about such issues is fine, but russianbear seems like a bin laden crazy fanatic when it comes to such issues.

Anyways, if my understanding of russianbear is correct, then he is against anyone who is even slightly opposed to the two points that I mentioned above. I don't know what Anand did or said, but may be russianbear thinks that Anand said something against either one or both of those points.

"Of course, you forgot to say that the cheating provocations and the crazy psychological campaign against Topalov started long before Elista, by
certain Bareev (he is on tape)."

Where is the tape? And is Bareev equivalent to Kramnik? And does this all mean I am also an ardent Bareev supporter? It is hard for me to keep up.

"so let's assume that you're a purely pro-match fan and a newly adopted fan of Anand. Congratulations!"

Right there, you do it again. I said I will be as pro-matches if Anand becomes the champ as I was before and you interpret that me taking up Anand as my favorite player. Oh well. I tried.

"Can you please point out some of those self-serving and unsportsmanlike behaviours and comments?"

How about claiming he was the World Champion after the KO win? Anand got beaten badly by Kasparov in 1995, and was well aware that "World Champion" is a concept that has been used in chess to describe a title earned in a world championship match for over 100 years of chess history. But Anand chose to call himself the world champion after wining the FIDE KO, anyway. This "I got spanked by Kasparov, but the random event I happened to win is the World Championship, anyway" attitude is what I refer to as self-serving and unsportsmanlike. For "sportsmanlike", see Zukertort: the guy finished ahead of Steinitz in a tournament but admitted that he could only prove his superiority ti Steinitz in a match against Steinitz.

Cold Logic, calling me a "bin laden crazy fanatic" over having a strong preference for a chess world championship format sounds like a slight exagerration :) Just like the "Cold Logic" handle that is attached to this statement :)

Cold Logic: Also, forgive my skepticism, but I doubt you are new here. There is a person on this blog who keeps using similar handles that keep changing: whether it is "Undenyable facts" or "Obvious Points" or "Great Reasoning" (well not exactly these, but something along those lines, I don't remember them as they keep changing). So while "Cold Logic" may be new, I have a feeling maybe a person behind it is not :)

Quely: "The frequent changes at the top does tell us something important regarding ratings, i.e. that the arbitrary points of measurment from FIDE are unfair. Or at least just "half the story"."

Well, that's sort of my point. If the best you can say for live ratings is that they draw attention to how unimportant the concept of live ratings is, then it's not saying very much...

"But Anand chose to call himself the world champion after wining the FIDE KO, anyway. This "I got spanked by Kasparov, but the random event I happened to win is the World Championship, anyway" attitude is what I refer to as self-serving and unsportsmanlike."

Rock and a hard place.

Saying he wasn't the world champion after winning the FIDE KO would have insulted the organizers of the event and rendered his own participation absurd.

So the choice was between insulting Kasparov or insulting FIDE. Kasparov doesn't pay people to pay chess. FIDE does. Most of us can figure out the rest from there.

It's incredibly easy to adhere to perfect principles when you have no stake in the matter at hand and no relationship to the people actually involved.

It's basically a morality fashion show conducted in a theoretical world.

All this tiresome chatter reminds me of being on ICC when some of the better players play. Instead of taking the opportunity to watch the game, people start a separate game: "what is the identity of player X?" This seems to occupy them for hours, and they seem quite happy with it. Perhaps this is enough for them. But they're missing the chess.

I'm surprised that the rabid faction of Kramnik's fans have given up so easily. The "main line" right now is that Anand may thrash Kramnik but he lost to Kasparov so thats ok. Last time during the Leko match when Vlady was doing badly someone brought up the fact that Kramnik ate a shellfish the previous night or something. I'm still looking forward to that creativity level.

Anand is Anand; Always Ahead!

Don't even think of relaxing a little bit. Only a few more days.. So, stay focussed and get the next one, Anand!

There is very little to complain about re Anand.

--He's a gentleman at the board and away from it.

--His modest pride in his non-match FIDE championships is a very small fault if it's a fault at all.

--It wasn't unreasonable to decline the 2000 match invitation from the unreliable Kasparov, or to take a pass on the Prague "negotiations" when he had virtually no leverage vis-a-vis Kramnik, Kirsan, and Kasparov.

--If he wasn't sufficiently assertive about Kasparov's 1995-match conduct at-the-board he hurt no one but himself.

I disliked Kasparov, I supported Anand. I continue to dislike Kasparov, I supported Kramnik. But then I disliked Kramnik, I supported Leko. I disliked Topalov, so I supported Kramnik again. I disliked Anand, I continued with my support to Kramnik. Now that I dislike both Anand and Kramnik, I am contemplating of supporting both Karpov and Kasparov. My likes and dislikes goes kind of in circles. So I am not sure who I like or dislike. Everybody likes me but then everybody dislikes me too! Who am I?

(For clues, see below.)

...
...
...
...

Clue# 1: I am no russian!
Clue# 2: I can't stand my own posts that I recently put myself on my ignore list!!

So.. Capablanca's the best right?

"Rock and a hard place.

Saying he wasn't the world champion after winning the FIDE KO would have insulted the organizers of the event and rendered his own participation absurd.

So the choice was between insulting Kasparov or insulting FIDE. Kasparov doesn't pay people to pay chess. FIDE does. Most of us can figure out the rest from there."

This is a false dilemma fallacy. Anand could have said something else, like "I am glad to win the FIDE title, but the real title is the classical one". Noone is insulted and Anand is everyone's hero, including mine.

"You quote of Zukertort and analogy with Anand are actually very different. Events that Anand won are not random events, but those are what the then chess governing body FIDE called "World Championship". Now if the chess governing body calls it so, there is nothing unsportsmanlike in calling oneself the world champion."

It is a judgement call. With FIDE being run by corrupt thugs, I am not sure how much sense to call them a "governing body".

But in any case, the main point is, the chess title predates the "governing body", so it is not clear the appeal to the authority of FIDE should be valued. The chess title has a long a glorious history even before it was started being run by FIDE post WWII. So chess is not like other sports where title is a function of the governing body. So your argument is flawed because it is little more than an appeal to authority.

">Does that exclude Botvinnik in 1948 then?

To speed things up a little bit, (non-russian) Russianbear's argument is ..."

Poisoned Pawn, your arguments have already been refuted. See towards the end of:

http://www.chessninja.com/dailydirt/2008/10/awesome-augury-action.htm

"RussianBear,

Anyone who dislikes Anand has a real problem."

Nice one. I guess the fallacy in this one is self-evident..

PA's posts are ignored for obvious reasons.

"Anand could have said something else, like "I am glad to win the FIDE title, but the real title is the classical one". Noone is insulted and Anand is everyone's hero, including mine."

What would have been more accurate and better is if Anand had said "I'm glad to win the FIDE title but I hope to obtain the No.1 ranking for that is what indicates who the best player is, not some title holder who is at No. 6 or No.7."

Do you think the world would have respected Kasparov's title if he had slipped to No.6 or No.7 in rankings? The world respected him because he maintained the No.1 ranking for so many years, and not some pseudo title. The No.1 active player IMO should be the World champion.

Till now, this match is similar to Anand's routing of Shirov in World cup, 2000. ( Game 1 was drawn and Anand closed of the final with wins in game 2, 3, and 4 . )

Anand's second at Sanghi nagar was an American GM called Peter/Patrick Wolf .

@PircAlert - LOL, very well put :)

Actually was it Russianbear who said something like Anand hasn't played a match since 1995 and will get destroyed by Kramnik? I'm surprised no one has brought that piece of prescience up.

"If fide was run by corrupt officials, breaking away from it and running your own championship is not the solution. Be a part of it and mend it. This was not done until now. all sport need a governing body, otherwise it will be chaos. fide has done both good and bad things. its upto chess players and organizers to correct the wrong things and make better the future. disengaging from it, is only unsportsmanlike. abiding by it is not. "

I am not sure if you are addressing me or are just talking in general that people should do it.
In any case, I don't think disengaging from FIDE as it is now is unsportsmanlike. I think it may well be the best course of action. Besides, Anand is not trying to fight it from inside and "correct the wrong things" or something, he had been known to endorse the crazy FIDE decisions whether it is to award the title in a KO, etc. So I could accept your point about people working from within the framework of FIDE to fight the corruption and mismanagement of the title, but Anand hasn't been doing that. far from it - he has been endorsing the incompetence of FIDE thugs.

"Russianbear, you have lost all credibility and most of your dignity. So, please shut up and go hibernate with whatever dignity you have left."

Ad hominem once again. For some reason I attract those like a magnet. And all I do is just voice my opinions on chess matters. Apparently people feel very strongly when someone says something they don't like or don't want to hear about their favorite player.

"Actually was it Russianbear who said something like Anand hasn't played a match since 1995 and will get destroyed by Kramnik? I'm surprised no one has brought that piece of prescience up. "

Noone did because it never happened. You are wrong once again. I predicted a close match (and not one destroying the other. (Granted, that doesn't look like a great prediction either, but my taking wasn't any more extreme than an average one).

"You forgot to add a third point, (3) the winner has to be someone he likes, otherwise the winner is not a genuine WC :)"

Krishhn1 has started his interaction with me and clearly he(she) still thinks it is the best course of action. Too bad for Krishhn1 that by now it should be obvious to everyone who followed the discussion(s) that I said no such thing, and said the very opposite just yesterday.

I am amazed by the amount of twisting and outright lies about my position that has flooded these comments in recent days. I am surprised by how popular I am with the faction of posters who seem to have little to no grasp of logic. I understand many of you are excited about Anand doing a good job in the match so far, but I don't see how that translates into this apparent need to celebrate by attacking people on chess forums for things they never said. That seems like a pathetic way to celebrate your guy's success if you ask me.

So the choice was between insulting Kasparov or insulting FIDE. Kasparov doesn't pay people to pay chess. FIDE does. Most of us can figure out the rest from there."

This is a false dilemma fallacy. Anand could have said something else, like "I am glad to win the FIDE title, but the real title is the classical one". Noone is insulted and Anand is everyone's hero, including mine."

Your reconstrual still contains the insult. There is no false dilemma.